They can—and do, don't get me wrong—perform some in-depth analysis; but they are no less influenced by crummy decisions, poor practices, or plain old incompetance than the rest of us. From what I've observed all manufacturers, not some, ALL say to braze all joints while flowing nitrogen. Of course you will still have to wrap the valve with wet rags or the heat pastes. Products like 15% silver content Stay Silv® 15, or economical Dynaflow® are excellent choices. It's easy to braze the factory joints with no covers on the unit and everything is accessable. Thanks @ChrisJ. 410a has been around since 1996ish. If the evap. Yet, the heat required to melt the braze thins the metal around the joint. After brazing remove flux residue from parts by washing with a wet rag. No refrigeration system should ever see pressure anywhere near this yet this is just to let you know how strong the pipe and fittings are.
How do you think about the answers? Formulated to exceed the requirements for R-410A refrigerant … instead of brazing and purging with nitrogen. doing this keeps the flux outside the fitting. Still, following these simple steps can ensure leak-free connections and cut out time-consuming callbacks. Easier to protect refrigerant valves with lower melting temperature than required to create a braze joint.
The access to the blower compartment the machine gets pulled forward and twisted to the side. I silfos everything. Moving a system puts a lot of pressure on the joint. I will admit it's been a long time almost 5-6 years. The factory joints or coils may leak. Most people prefer nitrogen from what I've been reading, but it is becoming too hard or too expensive for me to get it. R22, I braze 99.99999999% of the time. For R410A, braze all the way. Any good service technician knows that nitrogen should be used when brazing. Heavy vibration creates havoc on a soldered joint. I was always under the impression that flux (same as in any closed loop system) will muck things up. it heats up way faster and you can get in and get out with out worrying about over heating the ball valve. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
After that, it's hit or miss. For the best answers, search on this site https://shorturl.im/avQjj. Don't forget, too, that if you're using a line set that has been used with an R-22 system, it is imperative that you flush the lines to remove all the old oil. carrier really started using it a good amount in 1999and 2000. Is nitrogen a must while brazing AC lines? Copper Pipe fittings sealed using Silver-bearing Solder are stronger than a joint that’s been brazed together. It looks like you're new here. Weren't you doing this yesterday? But I have seen factory connections that make me wonder ( Liebert ).
I know there is some controversy about this. Bonds dissimilar metals and is compatible with all refrigerants.
I have a filter from the factory on the liquid line of the condensor and I'm installing a moisture indicator as well. Old tricks hard to beat was doing that even with R-22 new system line sets. I wonder if it isn't a flux issue. At first, I found myself septical. If I use exhaust pipe to replace the cataliac converter how long of a piece would it take to fill in the spot? It's the subtle vibration that makes Staybrite a poor choice as much as the flux. The braze is what is melted by the torch to join two metals. I haven’t run into any of my connections leaking once all sealed up. i am a fan of brazing and have been for yrs, dont get leaks with brazing, considering the one brazing is competant, "The bitter taste of a poor install lasts far longer than the JOY of the lowest price". A Staybrite 8 joint handles more pressure than a Sil-fos brazed pipe connection. Brazing is not that challenging. They don't think about the guy in the field, https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/minnich-hydronic-consulting-and-design, https://heatinghelp.com/find-a-contractor/detail/dl-mechanical-llc, https://m.facebook.com/DL-Mechanical-LLC-315309995326627/?ref=content_filter. For brand new air conditioning 410a line sets Staybrite 8 silver Bearing Solder when done correctly can speed up the time of installing new line sets. Staybrite 8 is a silver-bearing solder used on 410a line sets and if done correctly is better than brazing in many applications. If flux is used the flux will turn semi-transparent close to brazing temperature. I'm not risking my compressor windings to flux acid moving throughout the system eating away at that varnish insulating material. I have enough experience to know , that I dont know it all, DL Mechanical LLC Heating, Cooling and Plumbing 732-266-5386. Author - Hard Knocks: My Life Inside Boiler Rooms
Thanks for the comments.If you go on JW Harris web site it's like they promote stay brite. If this is a Trane commercial 6 or 7.5 I can tell you that these suction connections can be brazed. Does anyone know of any mfrg's that allow this soldering policy? The bursting pressure using stay brite is a lot higher than brazing because the tubing is not annealed.A TRANE technician told me the other day he stay brites everything and I was surprised to here that.One reason for brazing I have herd is in case of a fire in the building the stay brite will pop at about 550 deg and release phosgene gas where the brazing is good for 1000 deg or so. Annealing occurs from heating the copper which causes the metal to thin. No refrigeration system should ever see pressure anywhere near this yet this is just to let you know how strong the pipe and fittings are. a perfect example today R410A. Some say brazing weakens and softens the tubing and that Stay Bright is just as strong because the tubing is not annealed. Stay brite #8 has a melting temp at 430* and a tensile strength of 15,000 psi vibration making it more than strong enough to handle the vibration of discharge lines. Most are silver soldered and no inert gas is used. The manufacturers are only "always right" in the legal sense. This isn't just for 410A, it's for all refrigerants I believe. I have used silver-bearing solders on many installations and never have leaks on my pipe connections.
Most people prefer nitrogen from what I've been reading, but it is becoming too hard or too expensive for me to get it. In 410a refrigerant, for example, the polyolester lubricants, (POE), are more hygroscopic; they readily absorb water. Guys just don't like it cause it takes time to charge the refrigerant. But I made my goal this year to use oxy/ acetylene more no matter what the pipe size. Step 1. I don't think the pressures that 410 runs at have much effect on brazed vs soldered joints. 'à”œ‚3r�“çày8c�u²œœƒ…,`ÆgCüŠ¼
I was always under the impression that flux (same as in any closed loop system) will muck things up.
It is a tin-silver alloy and rated for 410a. Stay brite #8 has a melting temp at 430* and a tensile strength of 15,000 psi vibration making it more than strong enough to handle the vibration of discharge lines. You may be able to remove the factory clamps holding the valve and bend the factory assembly to where you can get to it. This action and the uniform coating thickness minimize unwanted flux inside the connection. From my experience I find silver solder to work great on copper where a lot of stress from vibration or system movement will not be present. For R410A, braze all the way. After the flush, you're supposed to purge the lines with nitrogen. Most often it's flares or vibration that causes leaks from what I've seen. Join Yahoo Answers and get 100 points today. NFPA 99 allows using flux coated rod on 7/8" or smaller dissimilar metal joints. 1 3/8 suction ball valve installed at the factory with no stub in the valve coming out of the unit. I've heard that some still don't purge the lines if using a filter, bad idea? Yet on new copper 410a line sets silver-bearing solder has proven to me to be just as good as a braze joint. How well can a 5,000 BTU air conditioner cool a 300 square foot room. Has anyone tried that tried or heard issues with that Red stuff ? Bonds in 3 to 5 minutes. The flux should be the same consistency on both parts. If you think about it, where do we most often see leaks? Only apply flux onto the pipe, not the fitting. Use Stay Clean flux and a Bernzomatic jet torch.
For example, at 70°F the R-22 operating pressure is 120 PSIG, while R-410a is 200 PSIG. Furthermore, no nitrogen purge required, working with Staybrite 8 since only about 600 degrees Fahrenheit to melt. That said, 15% all the way, unless I've got to wet it with 54% first. Most people prefer nitrogen from what I've been reading, but it is becoming too hard or too... DAN THE AC MAN has given you the correct answer. If parts are overheated and flux is difficult to remove, mechanical cleaning may be required. The coating melts during heating and flows into the joint ahead of the melting braze alloy. I believe that is what caused the sweated fittings leak. I think that you are putting too much thought into the process. There's been the rare occasion on ref line repair when there was no way I was brazing; carpenter shot 5 16cc nails in our line set. It's been round for a while. Never seen an AC line brazed.
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